NachtRadln in Graz

Das letzte Funddatum liegt lange zurück und die Logs auf geocaching.com (GC1FJTN) lassen darauf schließen, dass der Cache nicht mehr zu finden ist. Aus diesem Grunde archiviere ich ihn auch hier. Sollten sich später neue Aspekte ergeben, so kann dieses Listing durch den Owner selbstständig über ein "kann gesucht werden"-Log reaktiviert werden.

Schatzforscher (OC-Support)

Cachebeschreibung geändert da eine Tafel nicht mehr vorhanden war

Beschreibung an die Realität angepasst. Viel Spaß beim Suchen ;-)

• Strecke und Cache kontrolliert: Alles in Ordnung
• Beschreibung leicht geändert

• Problem at Stage 0 was much less serious than feared. No real change necessary.
• Stage 1 was slightly improved.
• Descriptions and hint have been a bit clarified
• Difficulty and Terrain have been raised by 0.5

Area Groups 1 and above have not yet been checked but I don't expect any problems there. This will happen as soon as it gets a bit warmer.

Gestern und Heute bin ich alle Stationen kontrollieren gefahren:

Virtual -1: Ist nach wie vor nur dafür da daß der Cache ein Mystery sein darf. Wer nicht googlen will hole sich die Koordinaten für Gruppe 0 von (https://www.opencaching.de/viewcache.php?cacheid=129122

Gruppe 0: Alles wieder beim Alten. Die Konstellation hat gestern ausgehen wie immer.

Gruppe 1: Die Hinweiszahl war weg. Jetzt steht sie gleich 3x da.

Gruppe 2: Alle Hinweise noch vorhanden. Das Haus war wie ich vor Ort war nicht beleuchtet, aber mit guter Taschenlampe und vor allem ein wenig Denken und dem Beschreibungstext sollte die Lösung klar sein :)

Gruppe 3: Ich war vor 22 Uhr dort, Trotzdem hat es ausgesehen wie nach  22 Uhr. Im Zweifelsfall also weniger auf die Uhrzeit achten. sondern darauf ob Alle Lichter im Areal leuchten (= "22h")

Gruppe 4: Alle noch in besster Ordnung. Um die Hinweiszahl zu finden braucht man nicht sich nicht durch die Brennnesseln zu mühen, eine Taschenlampe ist aber hier sehr hilfreich :)

Der Cache: Ist noch an seinem Platz und in bestem Zustand.

Hi All,
as already some have noticed, the "Pacman's" at stage 1.1 were overpainted, even though they were not Grafiti by themselves and far from the usual paintigs. It seems someone was just in that dire a need of a canvas :)

As a result, Stage 1.1. has been disbanded and Value E taken out of all calculations. The cache already has enough stages as it is ;->

Happy Caching

Wert F ist wieder lesbar, vermutlich besser als je zuvor :)

Deutsche Beschreibung von Wert H der Englischen angepasst.

Happy Caching

Hallo miteinander

Das wichtigste zu denn Cache ist ja bereits gesagt worden. Uns hat er sehr gut gefallen. Die Abendliche Rundfahrt mit dem Fahrrad hat Spass gemacht, und so Kalt war es dann auch nicht.

Es ging zügig los und die Fragen waren sehr klar gestellt.

Bei Punkt 1.2 ist die Information nur mehr sehr schwer zu lesen, aber der Owner konnte uns da weiter helfen.

Danach ging es zügig zur Gruppe 3 weiter. Diese Gruppe hat uns am meisten Zeit und Nerven gekostet. Das erste Ergebnis hat nicht wirklich einen Sinn ergeben. Bei einer kurzen Nachfrage bei Orotl (ja es gibt in Graz Mysterys die er schon hat, aber wir noch nicht) ob die Location stimmen konnte gab es nur ein lachen. OK, nachzählen, neu interpretieren und neuer Rechnung waren unsere Koordinaten ganz wo anders.

Die letzten Stages waren dann schnell gefunden und Reitbertl hatte denn Cache auch schnell gesichtet.

Wir können diese Runde nur weiterempfehlen.

TFTCNT

Angi & Martin

Na das war gar nicht so ohne.

Gemeinsam mit ptom, Petra, JulieWood, Rabat und Reitbertl (In der Reihenfolge des Auftretens ;) ) bin ich heute als "AntiRadfahrer" doch fast 25km mit dem Rad unterwegs gewesen (samt Anfahrt)

An dieser Stelle noch mal danke fürs Leihfahrrad ;)

A-E gingen noch schnell. Bei F hatten wir dann schon Probleme, und hatten nach kontaktiern des Owners dann an einer Stelle woschon mal wer geschaut hat diese Zahl (die kaum noch lesbar war) doch noch gefunden.

G war wieder klar, aber H machte uns Kopfzerbrechen. aber sooo viele Möglichkeiten gabs da ja nicht.

I,J,K und L gingen wieder flott, und bei Punkt3 haben wir dann die meiste Zeit verbracht.

Naja... M war eh "egal", aber mit N hatten wir unsere liebe Not. Nach zahlreichen Zählvarianten kontaktierten wir einen der wenigen Vorfinder, und mussten dann mit einer ganz anderen Zählweise dann den Wert für N ermitteln.
Also diese Frage könnte man vielleicht etwas überarbeiten.

Ab dann gings wieder gut weiter, und Reitbertl erblickte die Dose als erster.

Der AfterCacheHopfenblütentee war dann wohlverdient :-)

In Summe wars in dieser Runde ein netter Nachtcache, der weniger unklar war, als befürchtet.

tftc

Mit diesem Cache hab ich schon vor Monaten begonnen. Bis Stage 3 ging damals auch alles glatt (außer daß ich den zum damaligen Zeitpunkt noch komplett zerlegten Puchsteg überwinden mußte). Bei Stage 3 geriet ich dann allerdings ziemlich in Schieflage. Erstmal sind die "2m Umkreis" bei M nicht allzu wörtlich zu nehmen. 5m kommen da viel eher hin. Was mich aber richtig reingeritten hat, war, daß ich bei den Platten eine falsche Zählweise angewandt hatte. Dadurch war ich mit Stage 4 über 100m daneben und bin in eine ganz falsche Straße geraten. Normalerweise entdeckt man spätestens da seinen Fehler, aber verblüffenderweise fand ich sowohl bei der falschen Position 4.1 eine Leuchtschrift, als auch bei der falschen Position 4.2 eine Zahl, und zwar mit allem im Hint beschriebenen Beiwerk. Aus dieser Situation kam ich erst durch Rücksprache mit dem Owner wieder raus und so konnte ich das Ganze heute endlich zum Abschluß bringen.

TFTC NT

augrund des tollen Feedbacks von cezanne, orotl und aj-gps wurde die Cache Beschreibung nochmal leicht geändert.

Hmm, was soll ich da noch viel schreiben?

Ausser eben dass wir (aj-gps und ich) bei 1.2 eine falsche Zahl erwischt und uns damit ein paar Zusatzkilometer eingehandelt haben.
Hinweis: wenn ihr eine Zahl findet, und dann noch ein paar ähnlich versteckte und in etwa gleich grosse:
Finger weg, die sind falsch!

Nach einem gezwungenermassen ähnlich langem Umweg zwischen 2.2 (der Hint dazu war/ist uns total unklar) und 2.3 gings rasch zu 3.
Während M nach einigem herumrätseln noch lösbar war, hatten wir nach langem Herumgesuche für N zwei verschiedene Werte ermittelt - beide mit riesengrossen Fragezeichen dahinter, da wir uns absolut nicht sicher waren was gemeint sein könnte.

Entsprechend weiträumig waren dann auch unsere Suchkreise im Zielgebiet,
Cezanne, die schon vor uns dort ankam, hat dann schlussendlich doch den richtigen Blickwinkel erwischt.

Diese Problemstellen noch ein wenig präzisieren, dann ist der Cache beinahe perfekt ;-)

Mit An- und Abreise hab ich diesen Abend rund 38km zurückgelegt - aber keine Sorge: der Cache hat den kleineren Teil ausgemacht ;-)

Danke für den Cache: nette Runde mit lustigen Stationen.
Gerade richtig für eine gemütliche Nachtrundfahrt in wirklich leichtem Terrain.

TNLN

Part 2: continuation of log


Finally, found it after quite a quest and a longer story .....

Well, here is the story. After a hard and rather frustrating day at work I decided to continue with this cache. I knew that orotl and aj-gps were also on their way, but I could join them as I am much too slow for them. By coincidence I met them close to point 1.4. I asked them whether they had already obtained all values at Group 1 and they said yes. So I continued towards Group 3 in the hope that I would at least be able to arrive there at the same time as they.

Having arrived at Group 3, I realized that my head-lamp was already quite weak and that I had forgotten the better batteries in my office. It was not easy to determine N with my bad light, and I was not sure which circles I have to take.

Moreover, I made another silly mistake which was due to an e-mail exchange I had with xro two days ago about the calculation method of the coordinates. Due to this mistake I thought that I must take only one part of the name for O as taking all parts led to something which appeared wrong to me (it would have been correct, but not in the manner I handled it). In any case, at this point of time I believed that orotl and aj-gps had taken another route than I and had overtaken me. I wanted to confirm my values at Group 3 and was quite surprised to receive the answer that they had to go back to Group 1 as they had taken a wrong value at 1.2

So I continued with my values. After a while I realized that I must have made a mistake. I contacted Wild-Wuggis by sms. As it was hard to type in the dark (I wanted to make sure that the batteries do not get too bad and only used a bad torch which I had brought as a backup), it was hard to ask what I really needed to know. In any case, I was surprised about the walking encyclypedia WW With his answer and with reading everything again carefully in the time I waited for an answer, I realized that my values were all correct (except a minor difference for N which did not really matter), but I had become a victim of what I mentioned above. Anyway, I had to go back to visit the right point for 4.2 - 4.1 I had obtained already before by guessing it, but was not 100% sure that I took the right sign before I got the confirmation and at the same time having had realized my mistake that helped me to confirm the position of the sign also on my own. Then I went back to Group 5, the final. Actually I had been there already before, but at that time with a wrong value. My motivation to start the search alone was not very high as I knew that orotl and aj-gps were already very close. So I waited for them.

Together we then searched for quite a while. Finally, I managed to see what needs to be seen and soon the cache could be retrieved.


On my way back I was happy that I could follow aj-gps for the first few 100 m (of course only because he was speeding down considerably) which were a bit hard with a bad lamp. The remaining part of the way I then cycled again alone. The way back was much faster as I cycled everything only once this time .....

From the physical point of view this cache is much less demanding than I had thought in advance. It is, however, quite challenging to make no mistakes and to avoid having to backtrack. Taking myself, orotl and aj-gps together we
cycled at least twice as much as necessary.


All in all I enjoyed the cache despite the fact that I had to invest quite some time into it. It is indeed recommendable to take along a calculator (I had none with me) and calculated manually (which was convenient for the first stages, but not at the end of the cache, but I realized this too late) and a reasonable light. My equipment was less than ideal.



Some values are still described a bit ambigiously which still makes a bit of guess work necessary. Aj-gps and orotl also obtained a value of I which is one less than the value xro had in mind, and we all had different values for N - I still do not know which value is the correct one, but similar values lead all to the cache area.

Thank you for his mini-adventure. As I am not able to do night-caches with difficult terrain at the moment, this cache was a nice experience and my first night cache since more than 1.5 years.

A big thank you also to WW (communicating with him also shortened the waiting time I had to wait until aj-gps and orotl showed up and it helped me to find my mistakes) and to orotl and aj-gps for the joint search for the cache, and of course to xro for hiding this cache and for confirming the results I had obtained at Group 2 and telling me that my value of I (bad light) was not exact.


In: TB (taken by aj-gps)
Out: GC

22:20
Found together with cezanne and orotl after 2 hours 50 - what a cache..
Met with orotl at point 0 at 19:30. We quickly obtained the necessary values and continued to the next group. At 1.2 our troubles started, we took a wrong value for F and ended up far after point 2.2 ..
At point 1.4 we exchanged a few words with cezanne who was on her way to finish this cache.
While looking for 2.1 we noticed our previous mistake and returned to 1.2 - after a while we found the right value; maybe a note that one is looking for a value larger than .. would make sense at this place?
At point 3 we had quite some issues with N; in fact I still don't know what to count there. In addition the question for M is somehow strange as well.
On the way I exchanged a few SMS with cezanne and we met again at the final location. After searching for quite some time cezanne was the lucky one and found the cache.

It's a rather nice cache, but I think that for F and N slight adjustments might be helpful. I think that without our detour because of F we would have easily finished this cache in 2,5 hours.

IN: "Happy Caching - Horseshoe GC"
OUT: TB "Trans Europe Express"

Today I visited Group 1 which became much nearer and more attractive to me with the corrected description and contrary to my plans also Group 2 which was a bit tricky as I was not properly equipped as I had planned only to visit Group 1. Then I broke off due to lack of time.

This cache is much easier terrain-wise than I had thought in advance and very nice as far as I can say right now. It deserves much more visitors and can be visited also by nonextreme bikers.

As the GC is regarded, I guess that some other cachers will be there before me according to some rumours. I do not mind this, however. As I am slow and even slower when it is dark I will have to visit this cache on my own and it will take me longer.

As I was curious in which part of Graz the points of Group 1 are located, I had a quick look at the questions associated with Group 0 when I passed the location.

With my GPS-r it was not trivial to guess which rectangle is meant. Actually I was not standing at the corner of any rectangle formed by lights. I then took for A what seemed most likely to me. I had no troubles with finding the arrangement shown in the picture and the value of B seemed obvious to me even without using a compass. I am not sure how C is to be determined. The German version of the text makes no sense at all as there does not exist a "Zweierstelle" in the decimal system. The equivalent to the English version (second digit) would be "zweite Ziffer". For numbers the term second digit is uniquely defined, but as in this cache numbers are sometimes not handled as numeric values, but as strings where a leading zero might occur, it is no longer clear what is meant by second digit. (BTW: There is another problem which results from mixing the concepts of strings and numbers - if the result of a calculation is e.g. X=46, the coordinate E 23.X would be equal to E 23.460 and not to E 23.046 which, however, appears to be the way the cache hider is handling such situations). It might well be possible to come up with the results the hider has in mind by playing around with different interpretations and seeing which of them make sense. If this is intended as part of the puzzle, the formulations should be changed so that noone believes that the formulae are to be used precisely in the way they are given.

I will most probably never finish this cache (it appears to take too long for me for a cache I can manage in the night by bicycle). In any case, it might be a good idea to mention in the cache description the approximate length for a round trip (i.e. getting back close to the points from Group 0).


BTW: The first line of the hint appears to be quite strange to me. I cannot think of any values for the variables which would result in a violation of the property mentioned in the hint. Why is the hint needed?

Verfeinerte Cachebeschreibung dank Hinweisen von Pelzwechsler und den Wild-Wuggies online gestellt.

Viel Spaß :-)